Author Topic: Maori Tradition  (Read 47959 times)

April 26, 2013, 08:08:15 PMReply #15

Offline guest1

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #15 on: April 26, 2013, 08:08:15 PM »
Some great research happening there, Ra...... look forward to more being revealed.  Laraine

April 27, 2013, 02:48:07 AMReply #16

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #16 on: April 27, 2013, 02:48:07 AM »
Yes, all very true, but now we know why, and from whom the Maori got these customs and traditions. No wonder they were recognised as being similar to that of the Celts.

April 28, 2013, 09:11:57 PMReply #17

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2013, 09:11:57 PM »
Absolutely fascinating thread this one. 

I have noticed, whilst reading, that emphasis is being placed on some form of Celtic intervention happening to/with/amongst Maori at some earlier time in history.  However, having listened to some of the stories told to me by certain of my own tipuna and at least one Tohunga Atua, (I am Te Ati Awa [Taranaki] by the way) could the possibility not exist that both the early Celts and Maori (by whatever name or names they went by at the time) have been taught by older, perhaps more megalithic cultures (such as the Olmecs for example) concerning their broad social structures - hence similarities?  This could account for observable similarities between the two cultures and not necessarily an actual physical interaction between the two.  [I am not saying here that interaction between the two cultures was not possible, considering both had quite advanced (for want of a better term) knowledge concerning travel by sea.]

This is merely speculation on my part, and I have no evidence to back what I have suggested up.  However, I do put it out there for consideration.


April 29, 2013, 02:49:46 AMReply #18

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #18 on: April 29, 2013, 02:49:46 AM »
VEDIC CULTURE IN NEW ZEALAND

http://satyavidya.com/vedicnz.htm

Dating back in History, we see that early Indians had links with the Easter Islands as far back as 3000BC, by the “Old Brahmi” or Indus script being there. In New Zealand, we have a ship-bell dating to around 1000AD, that has Tamil charactors on it.

Now, interestingly, our history states that around 1000AD, a “new wave” of Polynesian peoples arrived in New Zealand (Maoris), speaking the Malayo-Polynesian tongues. Coincidence they arrived the same time as the Tamil Navigators here?

It is more plausible, since this is about the time of the great Sailendra Dynasty, that these Maori peoples speaking related languages to the Indonesians etc. of S. E. Asia, were distributed throughout the Pacific by Tamil traders and Ships, that arrived in New Zealand.

We note many Indic and “Naga” (Eastern India and SE Asian) elements in Maori culture that also support this. As a Southern land, New Zealand would also have been known as one of the Patala Lokas on Earth, where Naga peoples dwelled.

The sacred Maori serpent and water-monster is the Taniwha (pron. ‘Tani-pha’). New Zealand has no serpents, showing it is an imported myth, and these people have some kind of serpent-worship ancestory. We note that In Vedic Dharma, Twashtar is the Creator-God who was father of the Serpent-King Vritra. Perhaps this is who they trace their ancestory from.

The Indonesian Malayo-Polynesian languages’ Indic shades are hence also found in the Polynesian branch, showing a direct link with India – and again supporting the view that maoris came across from these lands during the Sailendra reign, as migrants on Tamil ships.

The Maori word for the Sun is “Ra” – which is very close to ancient Egyptian and the Sanskrit Solar God-King Rama – of renown fame throughout Indonesia and other S. E. Asian lands through Ramayana. His triumph over the Rakshasas of Lanka who ruled S. E. Asian lands and freed them, is well-known. Ramayana mentions Yavadvipa (Java, Indonesia).

This, again, connects Maoris even closer with the Vedic culture of S. E. Asia and suggests the earlier Moriori were also an Indic peoples of this clan. For, how did the Tamils get here at the same time as Maori otherwise? New Zealand hence, must have been known.

The Maori term for “God” or deity is “Atua” – close to the Vedic “Aditya” – meaning Luminary or Sun-God. It is also cognate to Deva or God in the Rig Veda, showing such Vedic ties, also.

In dress and architecture, the Maori resemble the Naga peoples of Eastern India and S. E. Asia and those of the Americas – hence forming one of the many Naga peoples. We note of the Nahuatl language in the Americas and the ancient King Nahush of ancient India – who became demonic and was cursed to become a Naga (serpent) by the Sage Agastya (who is associated with teaching in Southern India, Sri Lanka and S. E Asia).

The Maori also share the S. Indian flood tales, associated with Agastya. According to Bhagavata – Manu Satyavrata was a Dravida (S.Indian) King that sailed into Himalayas after the last flood, along with the Rishis. Dravida lands include Gujerat and Tamil Nadu – where ancient Kingdoms, some 7000 years old have recently been found under the waters.

The Maori tale states Maui (counterpart of Manu) pulled New Zealand out of the sea in the form of a Fish – relating to the Vedic tale of Manu and the fish, Matsya, who saved him. Maori, hence, also trace back to Manu Satyavrata – linking them, once again to Vedic mythology and Asia.

The Supreme of Maori society was known as “Ariki”, which meant Chief, Leader or Priest. It can hence be related to the term for Vedic Kshatriyas (warriors) and Brahmins (priests) – ‘Arya’ or Aryan, which denoted a noble – a common term used to denote the great Vedic peoples.





Manu in Maori means Bird, which gives more of a clue to who maui was.
   
Legends of Maui Tikitiki-a-Taranga
http://www.deeknow.com/notes/maori/maui.html

 The-bird-of-the-sun
(Nga-Ti-Hau)

http://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-Whi08EAnci-t1-body-d11.html

This man the Bird-of-the-Sun was of a certain tribe, who were men (like our selves) who had a home on the mountain called Hiku-rangi (tail of heaven). Great was the evil of this world in those days, but the moth or the moss of damp cold (mildew or rust) could not get at the place where this man lived and Totoka (congeal) was the name of his house, but his appearance was more like that of a god than the multitudes of men of this world, and the lightning of the heaven flashed in or about his house with bright light, and evil or mishap never came on or near to the house, and hence these words in respect to this house:

    Fly, fly the Awa-iti (little rill)
    And will, fly The-bird-of-the-Sun
    And clear with light
    To the lower part of Heaven

He the Bird of the sun was a comely person, and nobler looking than the men of this world, and his servants were named Uenga-o-te-rangi (steadfast of heaven) and this person lived with the Bird of the sun at the same home, and they were each of the male sex, but each were sacred, nor did they even have wives, and Uenga-o-te-rangi had the power or knew how to fly like a bird, as also did Tu-waka (man of the medium) and Tama-roro (son of the brain) was a man possessing the same power, as also Maru (authority) had the same knowledge of flying like a bird, each of them had the knowledge and power to fly in the open space of the sky, nor was this power or knowledge limited to the act of walking on the earth. Rehua (split) had the power also to fly like a bird, and was equal in all the knowledge which those above given possessed. Rehua was a good man, of mild temper, and kind and attentive to the people, and fed the orphans, and attended to, and guarded the poor. He lived at a place called Tupu-o-te-rangi (growth of heaven) which was on the ancient hills of heaven, and not unlike Hiku-rangi (tail of heaven) and was as good in appearance, and like it in not having any evil there, nor was there any moths or mildew there.


« Last Edit: April 29, 2013, 03:10:23 AM by Ra »
A warrior is a man responding gleefully to the stern demands of manhood, even as a mother is a woman lovingly responding to the demands of motherhood. The two are akin, for what motherhood is to a woman war is to a man.

Kolbrin

April 29, 2013, 02:52:33 AMReply #19

Offline guest1

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #19 on: April 29, 2013, 02:52:33 AM »
Hi Lance, its possible :)

There is a Definite Megalithic Track across the Old World from the Atlantic to the Pacific

This Track passes from Japan over Micronesia and — Polynesia to the American Coast

http://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-BroMaor-t1-body1-d1-d4.html

(8) Thereafter the megalithic route across the Pacific is broken and incontinuous. Not till Samoa is reached, away to the south-east, do we pick it up again, for between lay the coral groups of the Marshalls and the Gilberts, the islands of which have not the permanence of volcanic structure, but are the work of the coral insect, at the mercy of storm and billow. The Fale-o-le-fee, or House of the Fairy, behind Apia, is an ellipse of giant stone columns, no mean rival of our Stonehenge. In the Tongan group, to the south of Samoa, we have again the size and the permanency of ancient land, and here we have the gigantic truncated pyramids which are called the tombs of the Tui-Tongas, and the colossal trilithon or gateway composed of three giant stones. It is useless seeking for such ancient structures in the low coral groups like the Paumotas and the Austral Archipelago.

(9) The track is again resumed away to the east in Huahine, one of the Society group, where a dolmen or colossal stone altar exists, and in Tahiti a gigantic truncated pyramid. To the north-west, in Hawaii, are the huge temples of Waikiki and Punepa, whilst to the south and south-east we have the minute Rapa, Pitcairn, and Easter Islands, lying in somewhat the same latitude, 27 to 28 south of the Equator, the two page 5former separated by more than a thousand miles of ocean, the two latter by some fifteen hundred miles; and in each of them there are unmortared stone monuments. To complete the megalithic story of the Pacific, we have two specimens of this ancient type of stone structure in the North Island of New Zealand, one a miniature Stonehenge, with huge blocks standing six or seven feet above the ground, at Kerikeri, in the Bay of Islands, and another near Ateamuri, to the north of Taupo, consisting of fifty great stones set erect in the earth.

Clear Evidence of a Fair Race having been Absorbed
by the Polynesians

http://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-BroMaor-t1-body1-d4.html

(12) But it is in Polynesia proper that most evidences of a primeval fair race have been gathered. Taken as a whole the islanders of this region have a singularly European appearance. What struck all the early voyagers was the fine faces and regular features of most of the islanders, and some of them broke into raptures over the beauty of the women and the stalwart grace of the men. They constitute one of the tallest races in the world. Their hair is generally abundant, and generally wavy, never kinky, like the hair of the negroids, and never rank and coarse, like that of the mongoloids and they can unlike these two divisions of page 32mankind, have, if they wish, plenty of hair on the face. The colour of it is generally dark, and amongst many of them a certain proportion of the children have brown hair, which changes into black only at full maturity. The complexion is, as a rule, brown, but it is very often olive, and no darker than that of the Southern Italians; and colour is as much a matter of climate and food as of race. Dr. Hamy, the French anthropologist, finds from new measurements that "in the east, north, and south they present a long-headedness very pronounced." Other observers incline to place them amongst the medium-headed men, neither very round nor very long. But the skulls that the Americans took out of the burial platforms of Easter Island are in appearance decidedly long.

(13) There are even cases of a cross with a blonde Caucasian race amongst the Maoris, and especially amongst the Ureweras, who have seen little of Europeans till lately; the urukehu, or red-headed, families and individuals are not infrequent, and the red-head is generally accepted as an indication of a cross between a blonde and brunette race, whilst it is acknowledged that this tribe, not long after arriving in the Matatua canoe, passed inland to the highlands round Lake Waikaremoana, and, struggling with the inhabitants of the mountain and forest land, ultimately amalgamated with them. In that other long-isolated district, the King Country, near the harbour of Kawhia, there are many of these rufous people, and, at the same time, the tribes there speak of their ancestors, the immigrants of the Tainui canoe, amalgamating with the aboriginals, the Ngatimokotorea. And they say that in the fore part of the Tainui a fairy woman called Te Peri had command. The aboriginals of the Ureweras are called by them the Toi; and Mr. Elsdon Best quotes a Maori description of this primitive people as peaceful and good, a contrast to the restless warriors that had come in amongst them from Polynesia.


The Fairy Peoples of Maori Legend are all European-
like, and in all Countries Fairies are the Defeated
Aborigines

http://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-BroMaor-t1-body1-d4.html

(14) A significant substitution by the Ureweras, when the urukehu are mentioned, is the word Turehu, which is used by the Maoris as almost interchangeable with Patupaiarehe in the sense of a fairy or beneficent supernatural being. The Turehu are also represented as an aboriginal people absorbed by the Polynesian immigrants forty generations, or about a thousand years, ago. They had come, according to White's "Ancient History of the Maori," "from the other side of the ocean," and conquered the Tutu-mai-ao, who had before them conquered the Kui, the people that got the land from Maui, when he fished it out of the sea.
A warrior is a man responding gleefully to the stern demands of manhood, even as a mother is a woman lovingly responding to the demands of motherhood. The two are akin, for what motherhood is to a woman war is to a man.

Kolbrin

April 29, 2013, 04:52:19 AMReply #20

Offline guest1

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #20 on: April 29, 2013, 04:52:19 AM »
That is absolutely fascinating !
Why don't you give this info to the Maori leadership, so they stop this "indigenous Maori" rubbish, that all us Pakeha know instinctively is utter rubbish, the Maori came here on boats, just like everybody else.
So, since I am 1/3 Scott , 1/3rd Sephardi Jewsih, 1/3rd German Kelt, can I make some kind of land claim on behalf of my ancestors who were first in this land ?
I'm really being tongue in cheek here, but there is truth to what I'm saying.
Your information is really very amazing, and should be taught in schools here in NZ, as required historical reading.
Keep up the good work brother.

« Last Edit: April 29, 2013, 05:04:42 AM by Enkisfreind »

May 01, 2013, 07:32:16 AMReply #21

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #21 on: May 01, 2013, 07:32:16 AM »
Concerning our current situation, it will get there bro, not only is the destination important, but also the journey, and how it is done.

Thanks Sha'ul , Good point, and a valid one at that, before the physical, i look at the spiritual value.

The lore of this land is the lore of your ancestors, it is your inheritance if you but wish to accept it, in a sense it is the inheritance of the world, it is the collective wisdom and knowledge of the ancient past, written into the land it self, in relationship to the stars. a 3d library of sorts.

That's partly why north island represented as a fish, spiritual knowledge/food(strong ley lines), embedded within the land itself.

No one owns the land,, we are only care takers/protectors, we all belong to the land, that's why the original people of the land where called tangata whenua(people of the land), the different tribes, are tribes that identify with the land in there areas, when reciting wakapapa, the speaker will often referr to his mountain, his river, and his gods, in a way to show connections to the different localities and landmarks of the land, this gives one identity, and there are wakapapa linage that is recited, that goes back to other shores, other continents.

In theory you could walk on to a marae(meeting house), and claim linkage, by knowing your whakapapa(spiritual genealogy), for you are a child of ranginui and Papatuanuku, heaven and earth, spirit and flesh, light and darkness, hence we are all brothers and sisters.

Like the star of David, and a upside down tree,  we also have roots in consciousness.

The word Io pronounce in Maori sounds like eel, and the eel(water serpent/spiritual wisdom) is considered sacred.

The Three Baskets of Knowledge

http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~dominic/knowledg.html

Traditional Maori thinking presents us with three sources of knowledge. First there is the experience of our senses. Secondly there is our understanding of what lies behind our sense experience. Thirdly there is the experience we have, particularly in ritual, of our oneness with each other and with the past. These three sources of knowledge are spoken of as the three baskets of knowledge brought done from the heavens.

According to most Maori traditions it was Taane, the spiritual power responsible for the trees and the birds and the spiritual power who separated Rangi and Papa, Heaven and Earth, who climbed to the highest heaven and brought back the three baskets, or kete, of knowledge.

The names of the three baskets vary from tribe to tribe. The names generally used are te kete aronui, te kete tuauri, and te kete tuaatea, though the Kahungunu tradition as presented by Percy S. Smith speaks of te kete uruuru matua, the kit of the knowledge of peace, of all goodness, of love; te kete uruuru rangi, the kit of all the prayers, chants and ritual, used by us human beings; and te kete uruuru tau, or tawhito, the kit of the knowledge of war, agriculture, wood-work, stone-work, and earth-work.

The understanding of what is contained in the three baskets also varies from tribe to tribe. What I present here is the understanding of the baskets and their contents given by the Reverend Maori Marsden.

According to Marsden te kete aronui is the kit containing the knowledge of what we see, aro-nui, 'that before us', the natural world around us as apprehended by the senses.

Te kete tuauri is the basket containing the knowledge that is tuauri, 'beyond, in the dark', the knowledge which understands, 'stands under', our sense experience. It is the understanding we build up of "the real world of the complex series of rythmical patterns of energy which operate behind this world of sense perception".

The third basket is te kete tuaatea, the basket which contains the knowledge of spiritual realities, realities beyond space and time, the world we experience in ritual.

Of particular importance to us, if we are to grasp the worth of the human person in Maori terms, is the knowledge contained in both the second and third baskets of knowledge.
The Second Basket of Knowledge, Te Kete Tuauri.

This is the knowledge we have of the reality behind the colours, shapes, smells and sounds perceived by our senses. It is the knowledge of the 'real world', which is:

...the seed bed of creation where all things are gestated, evolve, and are refined to be manifested in the natural world. This is the world where the cosmic processes originated and continue to operate as a complex series of rythmical patterns of energy to uphold, sustain and replenish the energies and life of the natural world.

Today a whole new world is being opened up to us behind what we see through our senses. This world is both much bigger than we knew twenty years ago, and much smaller.

At one end of the scale we speak of a universe with millions and millions of observable galaxies and that has been in existence for ten to fifteen billion years. We humans are on a small planet at the edge of one of those galaxies and have been in existence for a tiny fraction of that time.

On the other end of the scale we have known for some time that we and the universe are made up of very small atoms. Then about eighty years ago a New Zealander, Ernest Rutherford, managed to split the atom and nothing has been quite the same since. We now hear of photons, neutrinos, gravitons, quarks and gluons and all sorts of strange new words for the particles which make up an atom. The human brain alone contains about a hundred million billion billion particles.

And what keeps the universe moving? Energy, and especially nuclear energy, the energy contained in these particles.

What then of the Maori model of the universe and our place as human beings in the universe? The Maori model of the universe presents us with at least a two-world system, a material world and a spiritual world, intimately connected.

In the words of Maori Marsden: It is also obvious that the Maori does not, and never has accepted the mechanistic view of the universe which regards it as a closed system into which nothing can impinge from without. The Maori conceives it as at least a two-world system in which the material proceeds from the spiritual, and the spiritual (which is the higher order) interpenetrates the material physical world of Te Ao Marama.

Moreover the human person is regarded as the greatest reality of this world:

He aha te mea nui o te ao? Maaku e kii atu he tangata, he tangata!

'What is the greatest reality of the world? I say the human person, the human person!'

Yet this Maori model of the universe has several parallels with modern physics and quantum mechanics - the beginning from nothingness, the development and expansion over a huge time period, the importance of consciousness, and the fundamental importance of energy.

Underpinning the Maori model of the universe is the realization of the worth of every part of creation, a worth which comes from the very fact of its 'being' and from the link of each part of creation with particular spiritual powers. This is expressed in the word tapu, tapu, 'being with potentiality for power'.

Tapu is a reality of the natural world, yet has its source in the mana, or power, of the spiritual powers. Just as the different elements of the natural world, the winds, the sea, the earth, the human person and all within the natural world, receive their being from the powers of the spiritual world, so they receive their tapu from the powers of the spiritual world. I discuss tapu in chapter three.

We can be nothing, we can do nothing, without mana, or power. Our mana is the actualization, the realization, of our tapu.

The Third Basket of Knowledge, te Kete Tuaatea.

The third basket of knowledge is referred to as tuaatea, knowledge that is 'beyond space and beyond time'.

Tua-Atea is the world beyond any space-time framework, it is infinite and eternal. This is the realm of Io, the supreme God whose attributes were expressed in the various names attributed to him. Io-taketake, 'the foundation of all', Io-nui, 'almighty', Io-roa,'eternal', Io-Uru 'omnipresent', Io-matakana,'omniscient', Io-mataaho, 'glorious one', Io-wananga, 'all wise' ....

It is especially in taking part in the Maori rituals and in using the ritual karakia, the ritual chants, that we move 'beyond space and time' and into the 'eternal present' of the rituals.

The wider purpose of the karakia is to enable us as one people and one with the spiritual powers to control every aspect of our lives and every part of this world.

We are to have this control through the power of the word, the word of the ancestors. No wonder the word is so important in Maori life and the tongue in Maori carving. It is through the word that we are called to take our part as human beings in the whole movement of the universe: i te kore, ki te poo, ki te ao maarama, 'from the nothingness to the night, to the world of light .

In the Maori model of the universe, we have the power of the word and are called to be one with the ancestors and with the spiritual powers in the exercise of the word. Especially in ritual, which takes us beyond space and beyond time, we can experience this oneness with people, oneness with the universe and oneness with Io and take our part in the movement of the universe.

We are part of the process, not above the process. We are dependent on the earth for our material needs. We have not made the earth. We do not own the earth. We have no absolute power over, or ownership of, the earth. As many Maori say, the earth, Papatuanuku, is our mother and we cannot sell our own mother. But we have the obligation to respect and protect the earth, not only for ourselves, but for all creatures who are dependent on the earth for life and nourishment.

We are also dependent for our mana, 'our power', on our links with people both living and dead, and on our links with the spiritual powers. Ultimately all, the land, the people and the spiritual powers, are dependent on Io, the root foundation of everything.
A warrior is a man responding gleefully to the stern demands of manhood, even as a mother is a woman lovingly responding to the demands of motherhood. The two are akin, for what motherhood is to a woman war is to a man.

Kolbrin

May 01, 2013, 07:34:54 AMReply #22

Offline guest1

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #22 on: May 01, 2013, 07:34:54 AM »
Thanks  Laraine  :)
A warrior is a man responding gleefully to the stern demands of manhood, even as a mother is a woman lovingly responding to the demands of motherhood. The two are akin, for what motherhood is to a woman war is to a man.

Kolbrin

May 01, 2013, 07:46:01 AMReply #23

Offline guest1

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #23 on: May 01, 2013, 07:46:01 AM »
Some great research happening there, Ra...... look forward to more being revealed.  Laraine

Totally agree with Laraine on this one.  Quite fascinating.  Look forward to hearing more Ra.

May 02, 2013, 05:17:06 AMReply #24

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #24 on: May 02, 2013, 05:17:06 AM »
Tu meke Ra !
I've only just now read all you wrote.
Beautiful, it all makes such good metaphysical sense, and I have heard some of it before, though in Jewisih religious phillisophical  phrases, not Maori.
I'd sure like to meet you someday.
So, how do I, a white Kiwi,  1/3rd Jewish, 1/3rd German, 1/3rd Scott, walk onto a marea and tell my Whakapapa ? My family has been here for only about 5 generations, but here I stand, at home, on land my ancient forbears once walked, where do I fit ?
After reading that, I will never again doubt that there is much, much to be learned from "Maori spirituality.
My mother, a "white whitch", of some renomn in Tokoroa where I grew up, once knew a Maori Tohunga (please excuse my spelling). He once laid his hands on my head, and gave a vision, or prophesy, concerning my future, he said he had "taken away the veil", whatever that meant, an that in the future, though I'm not very big, people would stand in my shadow ?
His name was Micheal something or other, cant remember, but I do remember his"mana", and his spiritual power, which I could sense very strongly.
Thank you Ra, you have opened my eyes a little more, and freed me from a blindness to who, and what, Maori really are.
Maori, have kept safe, some of the knowledge, of my great ancestors.
Te hei Mauriora !
May peace , love and light be yours  !
Shalom.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2013, 05:20:25 AM by Enkisfreind »

May 02, 2013, 05:43:38 AMReply #25

Offline guest1

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #25 on: May 02, 2013, 05:43:38 AM »
I believe you will readily find such information within the Jewish religion, though it may very well be clad in words and sentences more suited to the Middle East.

It does us good to remember that these wisdoms are not confined to any one area and, if we were to earnestly seek these wisdoms, we would find them in most societies.  There have always been the guardians of such information and knowledge, and even when such guardians have passed from their earthly incarnation and the knowledge apparently lost, this is not the case.


May 20, 2013, 07:00:21 PMReply #26

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #26 on: May 20, 2013, 07:00:21 PM »
The following is interesting, a gathering of nations from the four corners of the earth gathered here in NZ, why? I suspect the kolbrin answers that question, but i would like to point attention to the main 3 peoples, and there possible relavance to the kolbrin particularly chapter one The scroll of Emod in the Book of Manuscripts.


'The families of Rapuwai and Waitaha stood in the land'

It was time to part. If the Nation was to grow within this land some would be called to build the gardens and fish the waters, and others to explore the land, chart the movement of the stars and walk with the Stone.

Our Waka carried three peoples. The Tohaunga reached into three old iwi to choose the families to settle Aotea Roa. Each went back to ancient mana trees that grew in different seasons. Their ancestors gazed out on different oceans under different stars. Some were born under the bright light of Rehia, and others under Rehua, to be divided by the widest waters in the world.

They came from the four winds. Some were dark skinned and some were white, yet they gathered at Waitangi Ki Roto and lived as one. They learned to speak as one and work as one in the interest of all. We honour forever the three coloured strands that came together in this land to bind the heart,, mind and spirit of the Nation...

Uru Kehu were the children of Kiwa, the golden ones, the short people with pale freckled skin, blue eyes and fair red hair. They came to Waitangi Ki Roto out of the rising Sun.

Maoriori looked back to Hotu Matua, for they were a dark skinned, very tall, big boned people, with dark eyes and long black hair. Their trail began in the lands of the setting Sun.

Kiritea were small and fir skinned and had long black hair and green eyes. Their features carried the marks of the tallest of all mountains, and the enduring qualities of stone.

Song of Waitaha ` The Histories Of A Nation



Thanks shaul, ill send you a message, would be good to meet, i only stay an hour away from you :)



Wise words lance, I am very interested in the history in your area, would love to explore some of the ancient pa sites around there some day.

Here is a video i made of them a while back.

In the land of tara

« Last Edit: May 21, 2013, 03:43:46 AM by Ra »
A warrior is a man responding gleefully to the stern demands of manhood, even as a mother is a woman lovingly responding to the demands of motherhood. The two are akin, for what motherhood is to a woman war is to a man.

Kolbrin

May 20, 2013, 08:11:56 PMReply #27

Offline guest1

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #27 on: May 20, 2013, 08:11:56 PM »
Thanks for the information Ra.  Absolutely fascinating to say the least.

I hadn't really taken much notice of the pa sites around Taranaki, being concerned mainly with my own at Urenui, Waitara and Parehaka.  It was really interesting to see the use of old world technologies in the form of conical, trapezoid, square, tri-sided, and sacred geometric pyramids used in the construction of most of these pa.  I was familiar with the serpentine/vortex construct of a number of pa, but not so to this degree.  Wonderful.  The use of both ancient and more modern ley systems was also interesting to see.

Thank you.  This has given me a somewhat different perspective on things, especially as it relates to my own people and lands.

July 26, 2013, 04:37:18 PMReply #28

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #28 on: July 26, 2013, 04:37:18 PM »
Thanks for the information Ra.  Absolutely fascinating to say the least.

I hadn't really taken much notice of the pa sites around Taranaki, being concerned mainly with my own at Urenui, Waitara and Parehaka.  It was really interesting to see the use of old world technologies in the form of conical, trapezoid, square, tri-sided, and sacred geometric pyramids used in the construction of most of these pa.  I was familiar with the serpentine/vortex construct of a number of pa, but not so to this degree.  Wonderful.  The use of both ancient and more modern ley systems was also interesting to see.

Thank you.  This has given me a somewhat different perspective on things, especially as it relates to my own people and lands.

I agree Lance, the old world technologies are indeed found within many ancient pa's and sites around NZ.

The following to me is part of the answer to how these technologies got here :)

BES OF EGYPT & TARANAICH-THOR OF EUROPE IN THE ANCIENT SOUTH PACIFIC.

Mount Taranaki was, without doubt, ancient New Zealand's foremost navigational beacon. As an active volcano on the western sea coastline facing Australia and Western Polynesia, it's smoky plume would have been visible for a great distance over the horizon. In line with similar belief systems amongst great civilisations, its imposing majesty would have invited religious veneration, in conjunction with the other volcanic peaks further inland.

"Tara" in Maori means apex, fin or spine.

The very ancient European tribes migrating all the way to Britain left a trail behind them of "Tara" derived names

In consideration of ancient Welsh/ Gaelic/ Breton/ Khumri variations on "Tara" we have the following:

"Taran" means "thunder" in Welsh/ Breton/ Khumri. The word "Tardd" would mean "breaking out".

"Tartar" means noise or clamour in Irish/ Gaelic.

Each of these descriptions in Welsh/ Khumri or Irish/ Gaelic migrated to Wales and Ireland via Scandinavia and Germany, where "Thor", meaning literally"thunder", was the pre-eminent Deity and created great thunder claps by crashing two rams heads together.

The Continental European Celts called their God, "Taranis" (the thunderer) and he bore that name in France and Spain amongst the Druids, as well as, seemingly, Celtic countries like Germany, Switzerland and Yugoslavia further east. The name Taranis derives from the Celtic (or Indo-European) root "Taran" meaning "thunderer or thunder" and he was associated with Jupiter.

Another variation on the name was "Taranucnus" or "Taranus"...used in Britain. Taranaich (which is very close in pronunciation to Taranaki) is the Scot/ Pict/ Gaelic god of thunder & lightning. His name was derived from the Gaelic word tarnach or tarna, ‘thunder’. His attribute was the spoked wheel. Taranis, Taran, Taranus, Taranucus, Taranucnus, Taranaich all relate to "Thunderer", the Celtic thunder god and ‘god of heaven’. His symbol was the spoked wheel and a stylized spiral representing lightning. The wheel was normally considered to be a sun symbol, but could also be associated with the thunder god's chariot rumbling across the sky.

The Celtic tribes, Turones, Turoni, Taurini, venerated the deity Taranucus/ Taranaich, which is not a tremendous departure from saying that the Turehu of ancient New Zealand lived in the foothills of Mt, Taranaki. A pre-Maori white tribe was called the Turehu.

The Maori name for the God of thunder and lightning is Tawhaki, which might explain how the second half of "Taran-aki" (aki) became predominant in the finalised nomenclature that described this God regionally..

According to the Roman poet Lucan, Taranis was appeased by burning (Bellum civile or Pharsalia I, 422-465).

This way of describing Mount Taranaki's name, which is the result of a more direct route of migration and influx of European cultural idiosyncrasies from Britain and Continental Europe to New Zealand, is very apt. It describes a thunder and lightning god (inseparable elements) that is appeased by fire. Again the god is associated with one of the great lights in the firmament (Jupiter). This name (Taranis/ Taranucus/ Taranaich) and description of the god's attributes fit the profile of "an active "VOLCANO".

The early beliefs of the Aryans, who migrated west into Europe, were retained in various regions of India and the Hindu God Indra is Taranis/ Taranaich.

The name "Taranaki" is found in the Waitakere Ranges of Northern New Zealand. Also, Wellington Harbour adjacent to New Zealand's capital city used to be called "Tara" as the Maori placename for the area. The ancient name "Tara" is used prolifically all over Ireland in many placenames.

http://www.celticnz.co.nz/Bes%20&%20Thor/Bes&Taranis.htm

This next link is example of the ancient geometry and knowledge these people had.

SIGNIFICANT DEGREE ANGLE CODES WITHIN THE CROSSHOUSE.

It is known that the Sumerians, Babylonians, Greeks and other great civilizations of antiquity, used an ancient system of dividing a circle into 360-degrees or 720 calibrations. Their method persists in modern times. The Crosshouse at Miringa Te Kakara (Tiroa) incorporates the same system and clearly encrypts solar, lunar and navigational codes (via the degree angle numbers generated) used universally in the ancient Northern Hemisphere.

http://www.celticnz.co.nz/Crosshouse/Crosshouse1.html

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Some information in regards to possible links/connection to the Giants and the people known as the sons of fire as mentioned in the kolbrin and Bible. We have many legends of giants within our history, some of our ancient chiefs and leaders were giants, there is even said to be a  Waka(boat/tribe) of giants that landed here. I suspect me or my partner has the blood or connection to these people, as my second son was born with 6 digits on one hand, a trait apparently common to the giant blood, we had it removed at birth, (we regret it now)

There were Giants in the Land
http://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-Pom01Lege-t1-body2-d36.html

The Myths and History of Red Hair

http://www.themythsandhistoryofredhair.co.uk/aliensatlantis.html

Other discoveries of red-haired mummies have come in Polynesia and the Canary Islands. In fact, both these places are, or were, noted for red-haired people. The Canary Islands was the home of the Guanches, a red-haired tribe that built monuments which can still be seen on the islands today. And red-haired people have been noted sporadically throughout parts of Polynesia, including New Zealand. One internet writer relayed the following legend:

"One Kiribati legend describes eels (Serpents?) coming ashore who turned into red haired men when they swam ashore. Another legend (Bue the Ancestor) describes one of these red men copulating with a woman who was bathing in the shallows at sunrise. The legend describes the "Sun" entering her loins, suggesting a child of the sun was born to her. When this child grew up, he set sail to the East (America) to look for his ancestors."7

The writer also noted:

"The Urekehu - or red heads amongst the Maori are believed to have come from a hot dry land to the East."

Perhaps unsurprisingly the writer elaborated by making reference to Atlantis.

"I am not suggesting that Englishmen came and did the Jack in the Green dance in front of the Tolai, nor that a Scottish mason jumped ship and taught these people a secret handshake. What I am saying is that Both European and Pacific cultures have a common link a long long way back in time, possibly in Atlantis 11,500 years ago...[t]he ancient culture of Atlantis was not just carried on by the Egyptians, but was also carried on by the red haired civilization of Tulapin (Terapin/Turtle Island) and were a dominant population in America until 6,000 years ago."

(just a note, Waitaha history states that one of the people/tribe that made up waitaha came from the land of the great turtle.)

« Last Edit: July 27, 2013, 10:12:33 AM by Len »
A warrior is a man responding gleefully to the stern demands of manhood, even as a mother is a woman lovingly responding to the demands of motherhood. The two are akin, for what motherhood is to a woman war is to a man.

Kolbrin

July 26, 2013, 07:45:10 PMReply #29

Offline guest1

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Re: Maori Tradition
« Reply #29 on: July 26, 2013, 07:45:10 PM »
 :) Hello Ra;   thankyou for the links,  good to hear from you, Laraine